New Tv and Harmony remote.

[Altimes]

Peripheral to the wiz issues, I know, but google is not being my friend and this forum has shown itself to have a wide range of knowledge.

Just had to buy a new TV, 12 year old plasma died Got an LG OLED65E8PTA. Now that is all hooked up and happily talking to T4 I need to rejig my trusty harmony 785.

The LG remote is Bluetooth and as far as I can tell the LG does not *seem* to have an IR sensor. Is there anyone here with a recent LG OLED (E8 series) or has experience hooking up a harmony with a non IR controlled TV. I suspect that I am up for a more current remote but can accept that if I can get back to only needing a single remote.

(The harmony forum is running me round in circles when I try to log to it at the moment)

TIA

Alan

[MrQuade]

Got an LG OLED65E8PTA.

Ooer, that's the top of the top of the range. Nice work! I have the older OLED65C7T myself.

The LG remote is Bluetooth and as far as I can tell the LG does not *seem* to have an IR sensor. Is there anyone here with a recent LG OLED (E8 series) or has experience hooking up a harmony with a non IR controlled TV. I suspect that I am up for a more current remote but can accept that if I can get back to only needing a single remote.

I can't speak directly for the E8, but the C7 definitely does have a IR capability, despite the native remote being bluetooth based.
The Logitech compatibility tool says that it is also IR equipped.
https://support.myharmony.com/en-us/compatibility

Have you tried to simply configure the Harmony for the new TV to see if it works?

[prl]

I looked up the LG OLED65E8PTA in my Harmony configuration tool. It found matches for three different OLED65 models, but not the OLED65E8PTA:

OLED65E8PUA
OLED65C8PTA
OLED65E8PLA

That was a search in the context of a Harmony 785 which is an IR-only remote. I'm not sure whether a search in the context of something like the Harmony Hub-based devices might reveal device configurations for other OLED65 models.

[MrQuade]

The other "E" ones are just the international models of the same thing. The "C" one is a lower model with the same panel and different audio. They are all the same barring the tuners.

[Altimes]

Ooer, that's the top of the top of the range.

End of model clearance sale meant that we got it for a good discount off last years price.

I had looked up the Harmony site and, like Peter, could not find clear reference the specific E subtype. That caused me to try searching for IR references with the lg OLED and could not find any suggestions that it was supported. The (eugh) html user manual does not appear to have any IR references either. Hence my suspicions that I might have an issue.

As you have one running I will try adding one as a device and report back. Could take a while as I will have to get the old harmony app running on Win 10

Thanks for the responses.

Alan.

[Paul_oz53]

The thought occurred to me that you might be able to program the Harmony using the hex codes listed in the manual though. If that's feasible, there are IR to Bluetooth converters listed on ebay from $120 up it appears.

Bit of a Heath Robinson solution and takes a fair effort that may come to nought.

If not feasible I'll cross the LG off my wish list.

[MrQuade]

If not feasible I'll cross the LG off my wish list.

Don't worry. They will do IR. LG aren't that silly.
Their HDMI handshaking sucks, but that's half the reason we have Harmonys in the first place right

[Altimes]

A bit more Google works suggests that the PUA and PLA are US and UK variants.

Just managed to the the Harmony App running on Win10 . I will add one of those variants and see how it goes (fingers crossed).

As a side comment, the difference to the previous 2007 plasma is very satisfying. Much clearer (duh) and when it goes to a black screen, black is black, if it was not for the sound continuing you could tell that it is still turned on (and that is at night with the room lights off). Kinda weird after decades of always being able to see some sort of glow coming off the TV screen when it is on.

The 4K aspect means that I have found a use of the YouTube app - running all those carefully contrived 4K travelogue and demo reels .

For anyone who anyone who may be curious the WiFi seems to work well too - running the Telstra speed test through the LG browser on our NBN connection shows the full whack. (Keeping in mind that is using a 5GHz link to a AP that is resident in the AV cabinet, so within a metre or so). Using WiFi since I had run out of wired ports on the AP. Eventually planning on retiring the trusty old P2 and using the wired network from that.

Alan.

[Altimes]

Pleased to be able to confirm that the new LG appears to support IR. Plugged in the US model number for the old 785 and all good

More than that, although the remote requires Bluetooth pairing, cover the business end with your hand and the LG remote does not work, that is, it IS a conventional IR remote. I guess that the Bluetooth is used to handle the *magic* functions (or simply provide an audio sink for the microphone that is on the remote).

Now to update all the activities to use the LG TV

[MrQuade]

There are also a couple of extra commands on the Harmony that aren't actually present on the original remote too. The Service menu for example, though I recommend that you don't muck around in there.

Can you try an experiment for me if you have any source devices that can output 4k video at 50Hz?
I'd be interested to know if the 2018 models suffer from the same desaturated colour as the 2017 models (like mine). It only affects 4K at 50Hz (not 24, or 60).

[prl]

Pleased to be able to confirm that the new LG appears to support IR. Plugged in the US model number for the old 785 and all good

Great to hear! Good to see another 785 user, too

[prl]

I've been thinking that a useful pre-purchase test (too late in this case, of course) might be to load the Harmony with the device definitions of TV models you're thinking of buying and ask the salesfolk where you want to buy if you can test out the Harmony config in the saleroom.

[Altimes]

Can you try an experiment for me if you have any source devices that can output 4k video at 50Hz?
I'd be interested to know if the 2018 models suffer from the same desaturated colour as the 2017 models (like mine). It only affects 4K at 50Hz (not 24, or 60).

Happy to try if you can point me at some likely YouTube or other accessible source. I assume that a U4 can output 4K @ 50Hz.

There are also a couple of extra commands on the Harmony that aren't actually present on the original remote too. The Service menu for example, though I recommend that you don't muck around in there.

Service menu prompts for PIN.....SAP doesn’t appear to do anything.

On a, yet another, side issue.... whilst reworking the Harmony I pursued dealing with the power toggle vs discrete on/off codes (slack I know....). I appear to see inverted power on/off from the Harmony, that is, to get it to work I had to choose power off for power on function and power on for power off. I noted the reference to misnamed codes. Was that it ?

Alan.

[prl]

Discrete power for the TV or for the Beyonwiz?

[Altimes]

Discrete power for the TV or for the Beyonwiz?

For the T4.

I have turned off the short power option in setup. This using updated beta beyonwiz 17.5.20181104 (17.5-800-g3d9a605).

[MrQuade]

Can you try an experiment for me if you have any source devices that can output 4k video at 50Hz?
I'd be interested to know if the 2018 models suffer from the same desaturated colour as the 2017 models (like mine). It only affects 4K at 50Hz (not 24, or 60).

Happy to try if you can point me at some likely YouTube or other accessible source. I assume that a U4 can output 4K @ 50Hz.

You'll only see it from external sources like a U4, or a 4K capable media device like an Apple TV, Foxtel IQ4, XBox One, PS4, NVidia Shield etc...

On a, yet another, side issue.... whilst reworking the Harmony I pursued dealing with the power toggle vs discrete on/off codes (slack I know....). I appear to see inverted power on/off from the Harmony, that is, to get it to work I had to choose power off for power on function and power on for power off. I noted the reference to misnamed codes. Was that it ?

Strange, I've not noticed that while testing the Harmony on the T or U series.

What command are you using for the "Power Off""? "Deep Standby" or "Suspend"? (also note that you need to continue using the "Power Toggle" code to turn the Wiz on, as this serves as the "Power On" command, because the "Wake" command will not function to turn the Wiz on from a Deep Standby state)

[Altimes]

The harmony app for the 785 is the older one. For the T4, once you tell it to use discrete power buttons I only saw PowerOn and PowerOff not PowerToggle. PowerToggle shows up if you tell it that it only has a single power button.

I guess I should look in the log and see what is actually being sent.

I am trying to address the issue of the Wiz going into standby when already on and getting the power toggle command when SWHBO starts the systems to watch a recording.

To be honest, as I write it is “not broken”. I did try adding a second T4 device but its behaviour was the same, that is, using on for on and off for off, gave the appearance of inverted behaviour. On a guess, a chose off for on and on for off and got the expected behaviour which just suggested that the IR codes may have been wrongly named in the Harmony back end.

[Altimes]

only affects 4K at 50Hz (not 24, or 60).

So, just such that I am with you, the source material is not a concern. Simply plug in the U4 (which is all that have can put out 4K) and set it to specific outputs and see if I can detect any visual differences for the same material.

[MrQuade]

The harmony app for the 785 is the older one. For the T4, once you tell it to use discrete power buttons I only saw PowerOn and PowerOff not PowerToggle. PowerToggle shows up if you tell it that it only has a single power button.

My old screenshots show a "Power Toggle" command, but perhaps the database has changed since then.

To be honest, as I write it is “not broken”. I did try adding a second T4 device but its behaviour was the same, that is, using on for on and off for off, gave the appearance of inverted behaviour. On a guess, a chose off for on and on for off and got the expected behaviour which just suggested that the IR codes may have been wrongly named in the Harmony back end.

Something odd maybe happening as you say. You sound like you can track it down though

So, just such that I am with you, the source material is not a concern. Simply plug in the U4 (which is all that have can put out 4K) and set it to specific outputs and see if I can detect any visual differences for the same material.

Correct, the source material won't matter. The difference is easy to see if you simply switch back and forth between 60Hz and 50Hz with the resolution set to 2160p. It will be particularly visible in the RED coloured button hint in the Wiz GUI. At 50Hz, the red colour will be noticably dull.

[Altimes]

Correct, the source material won't matter. The difference is easy to see if you simply switch back and forth between 60Hz and 50Hz with the resolution set to 2160p. It will be particularly visible in the RED coloured button hint in the Wiz GUI. At 50Hz, the red colour will be noticably dull.

I hooked the U4 up and toggled the resolution at 2160p between 50 and 60 Hz, selecting OK each time. Carefully watching the red button. To my eyes there was no perceptible difference in the any colour at any time even compared to the starting 1080p.

Also this is with Tv in virtually factory settings. Critically the display is in “standard” mode. “Vivid”, etc may be different but it would make lots of changes to ring

Alan.

[MrQuade]

Also this is with Tv in virtually factory settings. Critically the display is in “standard” mode. “Vivid”, etc may be different but it would make lots of changes to ring

Thanks for that, it must be limited to the 2017 series then. It has been reported and will hopefully be fixed. Oh btw, the issue was only present in a late firmware road on my TV, so if you haven't updated yet, you may want to retest after updating.

As for the colours, yes, the pop does take a little acclimatizing.
Have a read of the avsforums. There should be an owner's thread devoted to your TV, and there will be at least one professional calibrator who has provided the correct settings (and the are a LOT). These oleds are amazingly close to fully calibrated straight out of the box, so not many tweaks are required. I would strongly advise issuing the calibration guides, but avoid the detailed colour correction settings, as those ones tend to be settings that vary more from set to set. You should be using the "technicolour" or "isf" presets as a starting point as these ones are as close to reference as you can get out of the box. (As Usual, avoid the "sport", "dynamic" and other gimmick presets).

[Altimes]

I did a firmware update was early in the setup I am on something like 4.10.6?. You know the game, go through a whole stack of setup and then a firmware update wipes them all out I was amused to have the thing prompt that another update (~800 Mb) was available within a day or so of setting it. Luck of the draw I guess - though looking at the release notes

1. Improvement
1) To improve that the subtitle is not displayed when HbbTV app in on. (except US Model)
2) Change HDR luminance curve. (webOS4.0 O18 Model)

Nothing to get excited about..... The one I have installed enabled access to google assistant. I have *played* with it. For me the jury is out on the "useful or gimmick" decision. As some wag pointed out, in one review that I saw, that by the time that you have picked up the remote and pressed the microphone button and said "volume UP" you could have just pressed the volume button..... By the same token, whilst using the Wiz, I did ask "What is the weather in Gilgandra" and it worked, so there may be some use cases that have value, time will tell.

Alan.

[MrQuade]

The one I have installed enabled access to google assistant. I have *played* with it. For me the jury is out on the "useful or gimmick" decision. As some wag pointed out, in one review that I saw, that by the time that you have picked up the remote and pressed the microphone button and said "volume UP" you could have just pressed the volume button.....

I think that isth trap that a lot of people fall into with voice controls. They simply aren't suited or ready for doing *all* your control via voice. Voice is most useful for the once-in-a-while task switching type activities. So for launching Netflix, or turning the TV on or off, or even things like MUTE if you have to dive for the phone and don't have a chance to grab the remote.

I have Google assistant linked to my Harmony account, and I frequently use voice commands to switch activities or turn off my AV system as I am leaving a room, or if I have an arm full of children.